Comments on: Dead to rights http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/ Semper Ubi Sub Ubi Wed, 20 Mar 2013 19:32:55 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: harvey http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-43021 harvey Tue, 28 Aug 2012 05:44:53 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-43021 In many a Louis L'Amour western either a good guy or a bad guy could be caught "dead to rights." My interpretation is that someone is a dead duck, with only the whim of the shooter determining if he will pull the trigger and kill the shootee! In these stories there are several scenarios: the potential shootee drops his pistol [as in the sheriff had him dead to rights...so I dropped my pistol]; or the shootee realizes his predicament but is too tough to go out peaceably...so he ends up sprawled in the dust with a crimson spot spreading on his shirt/vest/jacket from a bullet in the chest/arm/leg/etc. Or, it could be that someone was caught in the act of theft: he knew it/they knew it/she knew it...and someone could or might call the sheriff; escape from the scene would be possible but escape from the crime would not be possible. Anyhow, this is my contribution to this discussion. In many a Louis L’Amour western either a good guy or a bad guy could be caught “dead to rights.” My interpretation is that someone is a dead duck, with only the whim of the shooter determining if he will pull the trigger and kill the shootee! In these stories there are several scenarios: the potential shootee drops his pistol [as in the sheriff had him dead to rights...so I dropped my pistol]; or the shootee realizes his predicament but is too tough to go out peaceably…so he ends up sprawled in the dust with a crimson spot spreading on his shirt/vest/jacket from a bullet in the chest/arm/leg/etc. Or, it could be that someone was caught in the act of theft: he knew it/they knew it/she knew it…and someone could or might call the sheriff; escape from the scene would be possible but escape from the crime would not be possible. Anyhow, this is my contribution to this discussion.

]]> By: DanielVincentKelleyOnYT http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-39220 DanielVincentKelleyOnYT Tue, 08 May 2012 19:18:01 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-39220 Matt got it exactly right. The author of this nonsense is wholly wrong. Dead to rights means, the person is no longer eligible for rights. Rights as voting, gun ownership and freedom, disappear upon conviction. That this was cop slang speaks to the cop mentality being their presumptuous ability to revoke rights. Matt got it exactly right. The author of this nonsense is wholly wrong. Dead to rights means, the person is no longer eligible for rights. Rights as voting, gun ownership and freedom, disappear upon conviction. That this was cop slang speaks to the cop mentality being their presumptuous ability to revoke rights.

]]> By: Trevon http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-28395 Trevon Fri, 16 Dec 2011 04:04:12 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-28395 You can always tell an expert! Thanks for cotnirbuting. You can always tell an expert! Thanks for cotnirbuting.

]]> By: El Sid http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-27790 El Sid Tue, 06 Dec 2011 20:41:30 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-27790 This could be an example of US usage being fossilised whilst British usage has evolved. These days a Brit would normally say "bang to rights" rather than "dead to rights", even if the latter is the phrase with the longer history. I must admit, that to these British ears, TWD's line seems most plausible. The average medieval lynch mob didn't care too much about rights of appeal, but the circumstances of arrest did matter quite a bit, it was important to do it correctly. The ship theory is just fanciful, the religious theories forget that in that context it is spelt "rites".... This could be an example of US usage being fossilised whilst British usage has evolved. These days a Brit would normally say “bang to rights” rather than “dead to rights”, even if the latter is the phrase with the longer history.

I must admit, that to these British ears, TWD’s line seems most plausible. The average medieval lynch mob didn’t care too much about rights of appeal, but the circumstances of arrest did matter quite a bit, it was important to do it correctly. The ship theory is just fanciful, the religious theories forget that in that context it is spelt “rites”….

]]> By: Ignatian-Mystic http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-27631 Ignatian-Mystic Sat, 03 Dec 2011 22:58:38 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-27631 Personally, I think that the interpretations given by T.W.D., Matt, and some of the others could all be applied to the phrase in different situations. Whatever floats your boat. Personally, I think that the interpretations given by T.W.D., Matt, and some of the others could all be applied to the phrase in different situations. Whatever floats your boat.

]]> By: Kristina http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-27574 Kristina Mon, 28 Nov 2011 23:31:45 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-27574 I think it comes from the Catholic "Last Rights", "dead to Rights" simply referes to be dead, after last rights... Where one's last rights are no longer availible...After death, you are judged, you cannot repent... Odd little quirky Catholic phrase which has been popularized by repetition.... You won't hear me use it, I am not Catholic... :-p I think it comes from the Catholic “Last Rights”, “dead to Rights” simply referes to be dead, after last rights…

Where one’s last rights are no longer availible…After death, you are judged, you cannot repent…

Odd little quirky Catholic phrase which has been popularized by repetition….

You won’t hear me use it, I am not Catholic…

:-p

]]> By: BobH007 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-18491 BobH007 Thu, 26 May 2011 14:16:28 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-18491 I've heard the term used mostly in a law enforcement concept, but wondered if it didn't date back to the sea-faring days when an attacking ship had the victim ship perpendicular to its path, able to fire a broadside of cannon. That would be at 'right' angle and the vessel receiving the fire 'dead to rights.' It certainly has a more romantic connotation for me. I’ve heard the term used mostly in a law enforcement concept, but wondered if it didn’t date back to the sea-faring days when an attacking ship had the victim ship perpendicular to its path, able to fire a broadside of cannon. That would be at ‘right’ angle and the vessel receiving the fire ‘dead to rights.’ It certainly has a more romantic connotation for me.

]]> By: Interlineal P.E.Ruser _ P.robable E.rror http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-11556 Interlineal P.E.Ruser _ P.robable E.rror Wed, 12 Jan 2011 16:16:14 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-11556 I dunno about 'dead to rights/rites' but I'm 'read to diets'! Food for thought? I dunno about ‘dead to rights/rites’ but I’m ‘read to diets’! Food for thought?

]]> By: chris collingsworth http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-7761 chris collingsworth Fri, 22 Oct 2010 20:35:28 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-7761 Duh, I can't stop using this phrase during sunday night football. Maybe now I understand the true meaning, I'll stop. I'm a lawyer! Duh, I can’t stop using this phrase during sunday night football. Maybe now I understand the true meaning, I’ll stop. I’m a lawyer!

]]> By: KY HOLE http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-5907 KY HOLE Sat, 14 Aug 2010 15:33:53 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-5907 I'm with G S. I’m with G S.

]]> By: W http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-4192 W Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:21:50 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-4192 I don't know how I stumbled upon this forum, but the expression "dead to rights" is also used by people in Law Enforcement. My cousin told me a story about his SWAT experiences of approaching a front door and a man was hiding behind stuff with a gun pointed right at him, and that guy had him "dead to rights" I don’t know how I stumbled upon this forum, but the expression “dead to rights” is also used by people in Law Enforcement. My cousin told me a story about his SWAT experiences of approaching a front door and a man was hiding behind stuff with a gun pointed right at him, and that guy had him “dead to rights”

]]> By: John http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/dead-to-rights/comment-page-1/#comment-4012 John Sat, 20 Feb 2010 16:49:13 +0000 http://www.word-detective.com/2008/04/11/dead-to-rights/#comment-4012 Steve is funny and G S is so right about the comments. Steve is funny and G S is so right about the comments.

]]>